shaDEs, I don't think anyone was attempting (at least not in this discussion) to blame the countries economic ills on the burgeoning populations of illegals within the US borders, and I certainly made no allusions to such a simplistic train of logic in my statements.

What I outright said (and have done so in the past) is that the illegal populations are a constant and unnecessary, and at least to myself, an illogical drain on our social services structures in the US. Anyone who can refute that statement will have to do some pretty goddamned good manipulation of the facts and numbers relevant to this issue since the cost is in the billions annually to the US and again, that really means as PLP alluded to, theft of John and Jane Q Publics tax dollars.

I think by and large the American middle class, who does most of the livin and dyin in this country, is quite fed up with the idea that our government hands out billions of THEIR tax dollars annually to people who by law don't even have a right to be here. So ... it seems absolutely insane that they should even be able to get ANY of the monies paid in by the American working class and it angers MANY of us that they not only can and do receive monies they seem by rights to have no claim to, but that our government would ever even consider offering these people outright amnesty for their trespasses against our nations laws!

Though past this issue your above post seems to head off into the communistic doctrinal blatherings that have become so tedious of late, let me ask for some clarifications on your statements:

1. Please name the regimes the US has massacred. This is not to say it's never occured, but more to the point, I wanna know what examples YOU personally hold to be true regarding this statement.

2. With the following statement you made in mind which has uprooted people(in Mexico, for example) in the tens, hundred of thousands, even millions, from their lands that they used to farm and forced them into the cities. And in the cities they were unable to find work once it became no longer profitable to hire them, so they were forced into the empire where they are either extremely underpaid in virtual slavery conditions, and/or driven to crime if they are not so lucky to get paid work, where they can be completely enslaved

Let's start off by asking WHO uprooted these people? Then, whose responsibility do you deem it to be to take care of these people, the US, who they are not even citizens of (nor typically care to be!) or their own Mexican government? You can dance all around this issue with ideologies of "in a perfect (communistic) world it should be this or it could be that, but in the real world of today and right fucking NOW who really SHOULD cliam responsibility for the Mexican peoples problems?

3.With the following statements in mind Back when the U.S.S.R. (after Stalin's death the U.S.S.R. became a revisionist state and social imperialist, that means socialist in appearance but actually imperialist in actions-phony communists) existed the third world had a choice of social imperialism or U.S. imperialism, but with the dissolving of the Soviet Union, and return to Russia, which is openly capitalist, now the third world's only opposition to U.S. imperialism is Islamic fundamentalism, which is a monster that the U.S. created to fight the U.S.S.R.!


Are you trying to say that the US actually generated/empowered/enabled the Islamic Fundamentalist regime, hierarchy that exists today to fend off the Soviet Union? If so, please give facts to back that up, and this should be a really good one, since the Islamic faith has been around far longer than the US has been in existance and I think history shows that it has been steadily spreading throught known history since its inception, long before the US could have ever played any part in it, but I'll wait for you to drum that one up, OK?

4. Here's one that really stcks in my craw ..... HARD Back to the immigration issue, what is this solution that seems to concern people here, and causes my posting to create such an uproar, this liberal solution? To get the people, "legal citizens", to pay for the "illegal citizens". But that is the only way to fix this problem really while remaining within the narrow confines of this system, by reforming this system. Bottom line is the people that pay, are the same people that suffer the consequences that come out of the bourgeois insatiable appetite for profit.

So I guess this means we Americans should just fuckin roll over and give the illegals amnesty, keep feedin and housin 'em, keep givin 'em free medical care, all while they come here and work illegally so they can keep continuously draining our economy even further by sending billions upon billions of dollar$ they send back home to Mexico every year (which BTW is a HUGE part of Mexicos GNP base!) because that's the only solution? I mean really man, should we all just start carryin around industrial sized jars of vaseline and a 50lb bag of sand so we're always ready for another good hard nasty fuckin?

5. Here's another juicy one Yes true, pretty much all of the suffering in the world today is because of U.S. imperialism

Sorry dude, you may be sellin, but I damned sure ain't buyin! While industrial concerns absolutely whore out sections of the worlds workforce for their own gain at wages well below what they used to pay American workers to do the work, another side of that issue is that people all over the world would still be makin a big 0 fuckin $$ like they had been for most of their lives had these interests NOT invested in land, power generating facilities, water systems, housing and wages in countries all over the globe as a byproduct of their industrial interests there.

Another facet of this issue is that Americans give more aid independent of what the US government does to needy people all over the world and usualy for NO profit at all, so try explainin again how "all the suffering in the world" is because of the same US imperialism that also makes these acts of human kindness possible in the 1st place?

Do you think all the billions after billions of dollars US citizens have poured into places all over the world when an earthquake hit, a tsunami hits, people are starving (like those mentioned livin in the middle of a desert and pumpin out puppies left and right when they god damned sure KNOW that's stupid, thoughtless and unconscionable!), or when a people is being pressed into genocide by an oppressor and just need some aid to help them make it through would have been possible? If we as a nation were not so successful as we are at being Capitaistist do you think any of this could happen on the same scale? Not fuckin hardly my friend, not even close!

So get on with it brother, I'm awaiting your response to this with bated breath

BTW : I'm still waitin for that mention of a successful communist society/government that ever existed. Pipe dreams are great man, but being built on smoke, are doomed to dematerialize as quickly as they come to exist at all.